Evolution

Evolution Needs a New Name: Devolution

September 22, 2016

The word evolution has become meaningless. It’s original meaning, describing a process by which the species of animals and plants originated, has been changed by the anti-creation crowd for the strategic purposes of giving them the upper hand in arguments. Now it is said that evolution isn’t concerned with origins, just change over time. This is a rhetorical feint, it’s not reality. The way that evolution is taught has also changed so that the newly educated don’t know what it means. Not only that, but the process in nature that we observe is of continual genetic degradation, not advancement.

Christian apologists, using the old-fashioned definition, try to fight the battle of creation vs. evolution but it doesn’t work: it’s apples and oranges. Evolution is an observed process, even speciation can occur. There were two horses on Noah’s arc, but now there are at least seven species in genus Equus – speciation. I don’t have a problem with it, because I understand how the process of evolution fits the context of history.

Evolution is dependent on death, and the passage of inheritable traits to successive generations. There was no death before sin, so therefore evolution began at Genesis chapter 3. Only it’s not evolution. It’s devolution.

Let’s turn first to the dictionary, for a reminder of what we have decided “evolution,” means: “The theory, now generally accepted, that all species of plants and animals developed from earlier forms by hereditary transmission of slight variations in successive generations, those forms surviving which are best adapted to the environment.”

If only the best adapted did survive, then may be evolution would stand a chance. Unfortunately, chance can cut down the best, brightest, strongest of any kind, leaving the rest to make do as best they can. Note the dependence on time in the definition above, lots of time. The assumption of an ancient earth is the basis of evolutionary theory. This brings up the issue of circular reasoning, but we’ll deal with that elsewhere.

If, however, we believe that the created earth is about 6000 years old, it is obvious that genetic decay, or devolution, has rapidly destroyed genetic variability, making the remaining species less adapted to survive, as they fall before waves of human destruction. God created all the animals and plants. Since the first sin, extinction has been wiping them out.

Devolution and genetic decay are analogous to the story of the tower of Babel (Genesis 11). After the great flood, the growing population stayed together in the city of Babel. They all spoke the same language at this time. The people began to build a tower to the heavens. God stopped this project by creating language and thus communication failure. The people dispersed to the four corners of the world.

This event initiated the development of the human races. Each race characteristic in its own way. Perhaps most characteristic of any race is that it is different. It fails to be the same. Information has been lost. By modifying and specializing in some way it is less adaptable overall. This applies well to the process of devolution. Genetic material is gradually lost through the generations. The survivors become more adapted to (dependent on) ever narrowing niches and, therefore, become less adapted overall, less “fit.”

We see the continual destruction of species and the reduction in the fitness of those that remain. “New” strains of bacteria are variations of created strains on their last battle for survival. One by one we are wiping them all out. We scrape them up from somewhere, people die, then we eradicate them. They are just trying to survive the vicious onslaught of sin and death produced by humans.

Darwin used artificial selection, like the breeding of dogs and pigeon fancying, as evidence for natural selection and evolution. This is to say that a person notices some feature (characteristic) of an animal that is variable. Examples are the shape of a dog’s face, or the amount of feathers on a pigeon’s legs. The human chooses males and females that show the same form of the feature they noticed – dogs with wide faces rather than narrow, pigeons with feathered legs rather than scaly legs – and mates them in the hope that this feature will be exemplified in the offspring. The offspring is examined for individuals that show the best development of the selected feature. These individuals are then selectively bred to others that show the same developmental characteristics. Most people could name or recognize several breeds of dogs, and so the development of breeds is used as support for the underlying mechanism of evolution.

It works just as well as evidence for devolution. Darwin saw myriad variations of certain types of animal and plant. An example is the finches of the Galapagos Islands. Darwin noticed that some had narrow beaks for catching insects while some had broad beaks for cracking nuts. He lived in Victorian England, a time and place where optimism and enthusiasm for pioneers and colonial spirited people was part of his daily routine. It was natural at the time, a time of new discovery, to see this variation as representing a spread of new types and diversity. In truth, the different types (species, subspecies, varieties…) show each a different aspect of the original, created, kind. However, through the mechanism of inheritance some information is lost from each divergent type.

In nature, selection is a much more blood thirsty affair. The story goes that, in the desperate struggle for survival, the best adapted individuals leave behind the most offspring. These offspring have the same advantages that the parents had, and have more offspring of their own. This pattern of “cause-and-effect,” is used to explain the origin of new species and types. It is, however, completely self-defeating. The more of the best adapted kind there are, the greater the competition for that niche will be. Then it isn’t very advantageous to be that kind any more.

Cause-and-effect is a misleading name for effect-and-cause. We see the effects of God’s actions in Creation everyday. Everywhere we look, whatever we see, touch, taste, smell and hear are the effects of God’s divine power. We wonder how the effects happened, and what caused them. As scientists have a priori eliminated God as a cause, they have to invent one. Effect is investigated so that cause may be inferred. We don’t know the cause. The cause cannot be known to us, it has already happened. All we have are the effects, so in science, effects precede causes. “I think, therefore I am,” is effect-and-cause. “I am, therefore I think,” is cause-and-effect.

Since evolution views life as having developed from nothing, there has to be a way for the basic DNA complement of a species, or cell, to gain more DNA. Humans have many times the amount of DNA per cell than bacteria do, so where did it all come from?  As evolution changes bacteria into algae; algae into plants and animals; animals into worms and mammals; mammals into men and apes; where do all the new genes come from? Why do cells and genomes accumulate functions and genes? When the largest Lion in the pride beats off all the others, and lies with the females in the pride, does it acquire DNA? When a garden becomes overgrown with one particular weed, does the weed grow more genes?

The evolutionist answer is random mutations. The Lion just happened to have a random mutation in a gene that made the gene more productive. The Lion was thus stronger, better adapted. Effect-and-cause. I think, therefore I am. The weed just happened to have a random mutation that allowed it to out-compete all the other species.

By denying the creation, evolutionists are then responsible for explaining how DNA, cells and people, sprang up from nothing. Where they explain themselves to, is a place where minute acts of creation occur billions of times over billions of years. Perhaps they think that if they spread out creation over time and molecules, no one will notice that their theory is bankrupt.

The natural tendency of the universe is towards disorder and chaos, this is the law of entropy. Dishes get dirty, houses get messy, gardens become jungles, cars rust and break; people get old, they get sick, they die – everyone is familiar with it, it’s life. DNA replication errors occur many times more frequently than we produce offspring. DNA information is constantly being lost from cells and genealogies, so what makes evolution able to buck the system, to defy entropy? How can random processes literally beat gravity, and drag themselves up from the slime into the organized pattern of life we are and see? Evolutionists have no explanation for this at all. They brush it off and focus on hypothesizing black holes, the effects of traveling near light-speed, the age of the ancestor of humans and apes; making maps of the creation itself, and calling it evolution; anything to divert attention from the fact that they’re chasing the wind.

The concept that evolution pertains to account for is fatally flawed. An evolutionary origin of humanity simply can not happen. It did not happen. The logical result of natural selection is animals that are less adapted to survive, simply because they are more specialized. The whole process is truly devolution. You realize, I hope, that you only need billions of years if you are building a genome with random mutations. If you start with a complete genome then you only need a few years to wreck it.

 

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93 Comments

  • Reply essiep September 23, 2016 at 1:31 am

    You have clearly misunderstood theories of evolution. There are so many bizarre illogical steps and misrepresented arguments, I don’t know where to start.

    • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 3:31 am

      That’s funny! You don’t like it when someone exposes the flaws in your paradigm I take it?

      • Reply byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 10:31 am

        Well, how do you like it when people expose that there were no Hebrews enslaved in Egypt for 430 years, Moses wasn’t a real person, the 10 plagues never happened, the exodus never happened, 2 million Hebrews never wandered in the desert for 40 years and there was no conquest of Canaan. How is that for flaws in your paradigm?

        • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 12:49 pm

          It’s not a flaw, it’s your opinion.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 1:01 pm

            its not an opinion that we have zero historical evidence for the entire exodus story which involves settlements of 2-3 million people. And we’ve looked for that evidence, what we found instead are small Canaanite tribes worshiping a tribal storm God named Yahweh as part of a pantheon of other deities. That we do have evidence for. That isn’t opinion, that’s fact.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 1:04 pm

            Believing non-believers because you don’t want to believe is circular reasoning.

            The Bible is not an opinion.

            What you decide to believe about the Bible is a choice. Science has zero proof that the Bible is wrong, because science = faith.

            Absence of evidence proves nothing.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 1:20 pm

            To put it another way, why is absence of evidence a reason for you to disbelieve in Evolution, but absence of evidence is not reason to disbelieve in the Bible? Why do you suppose you have a double standard there?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 1:36 pm

            I don’t have a double standard. I choose to believe the Bible out of gratitude to God for my life and to Jesus Christ for my salvation. I don’t need evidence or proof, my choice is made and I have faith.

            I am making the point that science is exactly the same. You have to decide what you want to believe then interpret the evidence to fit. Science = faith.

            The other issue is that you can’t really argue creation vs. evolution. Evolution happens all the time, there’s no point disputing it. I am disputing that evolution is the origin of the human race, and it it not the origin of the other kinds of life either. Evolution started after sin allowed death into the world.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 2:23 pm

            oh boy do you have a double standard. believing believers because you want to believe is circular reasoning. Believing in God because “God gave you your life”, is circular reasoning.

            No scientist chooses to “believe” in evolution in gratitude for their life. That isn’t the way science works. Science does not equal faith. Darwin, who started his voyage as a creationist didn’t set out having decided he wanted to believe in evolution and then tried to prove it. He gathered data and the data led him to believe in Evolution. Evolution is the best explanation we have given the data that we have, and if new data was collected that countered evolution scientists would reevaluate their views on evolution. You don’t question the theory of relativity, you don’t think that someday you just might float off the planet, actually that is exactly what you think, perhaps that is a bad example. But when you jump you don’t “believe” gravity is going to hold you to the planet, you know gravity is going to hold you to the planet. Why? it is after, just a theory.

            Let me ask you this, why is it only a subgroup of Abrahamic faiths that believe in a young earth. You never hear of a young earth hindu? or the young earth Shinto. Young earth science isn’t even convincing enough to sway everyone in the abrahamic faiths. If we didn’t have a book called Genesis nobody would believe in a young earth, because the evidence just isn’t there.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:11 pm

            I don’t believe believers. I believe God. God cannot lie. Humans can

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:20 pm

            How do you know that God cannot lie? Because he told you? That is circular reasoning. How do you know that God is real? Because he told you? That is circular reasoning

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:21 pm

            I choose to believe God, just like you choose to believe science.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:30 pm

            You choose to believe in circular reasoning. I choose to believe in demonstrable evidence.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:30 pm

            Blah, blah, blah… You have been fooled

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:32 pm

            Says the man who believes in an invisible man in the sky, not because he has reason too, but because the invisible man told him so

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:33 pm

            So where do you plan to spend eternity?

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:39 pm

            What evidence do you have anybody is spending eternity anywhere?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:39 pm

            Science has failed you

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:42 pm

            Let’s pretend that science has. Why should I believe you as opposed to a Muslim or a Hindu?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:43 pm

            The only time that God became a human and gave his life for me was Jesus Christ. That’s the difference

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:46 pm

            There are a number of deities who have in some way died and then rose again and promised personal salvation, why should I believe Jesus over the others?

            Also how many people have been resurrected from the dead since Jesus supposedly died on the cross?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:50 pm

            I wonder if you understand what is happening here? I don’t actually have to convince you of anything. The Holy Spirit will convince you if you allow it to. All I have to do is say the words:

            If you die without Jesus Christ you will suffer eternal torment.

            Faith in Jesus Christ is the only way to enter heaven.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:52 pm

            Why would I want to go to heaven?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:56 pm

            The alternative is hell. Your soul is immortal. You are going to live forever whether you like it or not. Now is the time to decide where. Location, location, location…

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:59 pm

            Why is the alternative hell?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 9:05 pm

            God is pure and holy. Nothing corrupt or impure can exist in his presence. We all are corrupt and impure. There is nothing we alone can do about it.

            When we die or if the end of time occurs before that, there is no option but for us to be cast into the lake of fire and spend eternity in torment, separated from God.

            God isn’t being mean or vindictive, it’s just that he is so pure that we can’t exist in his presence.

            The only way that we can be made pure and holy is by believing in Jesus Christ. Then Christ’s purity is imputed to us, and we can exist in the presence of God.

            For ever.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 9:06 pm

            Is God All-Powerful?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 10:12 pm

            Yes

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 10:33 pm

            So explain to me again why hell is the alternative with using phrases like “has too” and “only option” because those phrases don’t exist when dealing with “all powerful” phrases like “want to” and “vindictive” are perfectly acceptable

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 24, 2016 at 10:14 am

            Hell isn’t the alternative, it’s the default state. You can escape by believing in Jesus Christ.

          • byblacksheep September 24, 2016 at 10:23 am

            “Default,” “alternative” doesn’t matter what word you use, please explain why with an all powerful God hell is the default without using phrases like “has too” and “only option.” Phrases like “wants too” and “vindictive” are fine though.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 24, 2016 at 10:34 am

            You don’t get it. This isn’t about God. It’s about you. If you choose to reject Jesus Christ then you will go to hell. There is no alternative.

          • byblacksheep September 24, 2016 at 11:20 am

            But if you reject that Allah is the one true God and Muhammad (Pbuh) is his prophet, you are going to hell, there is no alternative, why are you not concerned about that?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 26, 2016 at 7:06 am

            Because Allah is not God.

          • byblacksheep September 26, 2016 at 10:07 am

            No he is Allah (which actually just means “God” in Arabic the same way Dios just means “God” in Spanish) and he is all powerful and if you reject him he is going to send you to hell but if you accept him and uphold his pillars you will spend eternity in paradise. Sounds just as plausible as your story. What good reason do you have for rejecting Islam but not Christianity?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 26, 2016 at 10:22 am

            Jesus Christ is God

          • byblacksheep September 26, 2016 at 10:35 am

            Says who?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 26, 2016 at 8:06 pm

            Says God

          • byblacksheep September 26, 2016 at 10:09 pm

            Yeah, and Allah (God) says that Jesus Christ isn’t God, which God do I believe and why?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 7:10 am

            Have you read the Koran?

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 8:19 am

            I’ve opened it a time or two, usually looking for the answer to a specific question about what does the Koran say about one topic or another, for instance I’ve read enough of the Koran to know that Jesus was not Devine like Christians claim he is, although he was a pretty cool prophet, not as cool as Muhammad naturally, but still pretty cool.

            But to be honest must of my knowledge of Islam comes from friendly Muslims just running around planting seeds. So far you haven’t given me any reason not to just accept their word for it, I keep asking but you keep punting.

            Have you read the Koran?

            You didn’t answer the question though which God should I believe and why? (That would be an instance where you punted)

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 10:43 am

            The Koran describes something that is not God. Not even close. The character of Allah is nothing like the God of the Bible.

            Jesus Christ is God, one part of the trinity (God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit).

            Faith has to come first. You can’t be goaded or coaxed into believing and being saved. You have to realize that you are under the judgement of God and that you need to be saved.

            Jesus Christ is the only one who can save you.

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 11:12 am

            This is as close as you have gotten to actually giving me a reason to choose christianity over another religion, please continue in what ways do Allah and God (we will just assume that “God” refers to the biblical version for shorthand unless otherwise stated) defer from one another and makes God better than Allah?

            You say Jesus is God, And Muslims say that he isn’t God, and that I should have faith in Muhammed instead. If you would just accept that Allah is the one true God and Muhammed is his prophet you would understand. Faith has to come first.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 11:19 am

            The god described in the Koran isn’t anyone I’m interested in following.

            Jesus Christ on the other hand, was God in human form who sacrificed himself and died for me so that I can have everlasting life.

            What did Mohammed do? He didn’t pay my debt of sin or cleanse me of all unrighteousness. Nothing.

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 11:32 am

            Because it isn’t necessary, Allah is powerful enough to save you from hell without needing a blood magic spell to do it.

            Why aren’t you interested in following the God of the Koran? The God of the Bible is capricious, fickle, murderous, genocidal, and cruel. And since Jesus is God, Jesus is all of those things too.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 1:22 pm

            Allah is nothing. Fictional.

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 1:55 pm

            That’s what you say, why should I believe you and not the Muslim who says your God is fictional? after all you are talking about a Jewish zombie using a blood magic spell from his own death to cleanse you of iniquities you inherited from a rib-women who was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree. That sounds like a great story but a fictional one.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 2:29 pm

            Do you go to church?

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 3:46 pm

            Nope, should I?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 3:54 pm

            God promises that if you diligently seek Him, He will make Himself known to you.

            The Bible also says that faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

            If you’re not in church listening to good preaching, then you’re not being very diligent, are you?

            You have a lot of good questions about which God and why? But are you prepared to do what is necessary to have your questions answered?

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 4:42 pm

            I have to go to church to get to know your God. But I have to go to mosque to get to know the God of Islam, and I have to go to the synagogue to get to know the God of the Judaism. Do you have any idea how many religious festivals Hindus have? After all they have a few gods I should get to know if I’m going to make an informed decision. And then there is Buddhism and Taoism and Sikhism and Shintoism. And if I do go to church should it be an Orthodox Church or a Catholic Church or a Protestant church. And if it is a Protestant church should I go to a baptist church or a Mennonite church or a Methodist church, or a Pentecostal church.

            This is why I asked why you became a Christian (not how, why). There are so many religions and denominations to choose from.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 4:55 pm

            But only one God became a man and died on a cross to set you free from sin: Jesus Christ.

            It is so simple.

            Why do you insist on making it complicated?

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 10:50 pm

            Sure the second time, the first time he drowned the whole world, and the third time he is going to burn it. One out of three is a failing grade.

            Jesus may or may not be the only God to do all three of those things, become a man, die and rise again, and offer salvation. But there are no shortage of miraculous births of God-men, dying and rising gods were a literary motif at the time, nor was Jesus the first personal savior God. Why should i give Christianity credit for mashing popular genres of mythology into one story? Just because you mash a natural disaster movie with a shark attacks movie doesn’t make sharknado a good movie.

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:42 pm

            Don’t think I didn’t notice you didn’t answer the question

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:44 pm

            You can whine about technicalities all you want. You are going to reject the free gift of everlasting life because it doesn’t have a testable hypothesis. Science has failed you

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:48 pm

            I just don’t want to accept the wrong free gift, what if I pick the wrong gift and make the real God madder and madder every time I pray? I want to be sure don’t I? I should have good reason for picking one religion over another right? Surely you can understand that

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:54 pm

            If you trust Jesus Christ and confess him as savior (Romans 10:9) you will be born again. At that moment you will receive the Holy Spirit (the spirit of truth) who gives you the assurance of salvation.

            Buddha, Vishnu, whatever other idol you want to mention, are dead. I serve a risen savior: Jesus Christ

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 8:58 pm

            Zalmoxis died and rose again and promised that death was just the beginning of immortality, maybe his immortality is better than your immortality, oh and he accomplished that before Jesus came on the scene. Why should I pick Jesus over him

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 10:12 pm

            Do you want to live forever?

          • byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 10:35 pm

            I suppose that will depend on what I would be doing forever, what are the perks of heaven again? Because last time I checked it primarily involved worshipping a capricious, mass murdering, psychopath endlessly for all infinity, which in my opinion would be a fate worse than fire and brimstone so I’ll pass

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 24, 2016 at 10:15 am

            Why don’t you take a look at Revelation chapters 21 & 22. It describes heaven far better than I could

          • byblacksheep September 24, 2016 at 10:28 am

            Why should I trust the bible as a legitimate source? If you are going to threaten me with hell or try to appeal to me with heaven you have to first convince that they are real. If you want to use the bible as a legitimate source, you have to convince me that it is true. Which brings me back to historical evidence tells us the exodus, which is pretty much the foundational Jewish mythology, and what’s more than that we can trace where the Hebrews stole their mythology from other cultures. They didn’t even come up with original fake stories

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 24, 2016 at 10:37 am

            I don’t have to convince you, that is the work of the Holy Spirit. My job is to preach the gospel of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ. My own personal twist on that is that science is not a substitute for faith, because science requires faith.

            I Believe the Bible because I choose to. It has nothing to do with evidence or proof.

            You believe science because you think it has evidence and proof. I’m showing you that it doesn’t.

          • byblacksheep September 24, 2016 at 11:17 am

            The Holy Spirit is using you right now, and you are blowing it dude. Science isn’t a faith based system. You don’t believe “in” science, you believe in what science. I’m happy to believe in anything the bible can prove. But let’s pretend science is a faith based system, why should I trade one faith based system without evidence for another faith based system without evidence. And if I’m trading, why should I switch to yours? The Vedas are far older then even the book of job which is the oldest book in the bible. Logically speaking if I’m going to believe someone(s) created the universe wouldn’t the oldest claim have the highest probability of being true, not the one the came hundreds of years later suddenly with a competing claim?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 26, 2016 at 7:06 am

            I have exactly the same evidence that you have. I can’t help it if you don’t understand evidence.

          • byblacksheep September 26, 2016 at 11:03 am

            You could actually, that is the beautiful thing about evidence, you can explain it so people understand it. You could say “this is the evidence, this is why I think it means what i think it means” and then we can have competing ideas and it is very exciting.

            You say Jesus Christ is God, what evidence do you have for that? The bible? The way you feel inside? The Koran says Jesus wasn’t God, although he was a pretty cool dude. Why is the bible more credible than the Koran? Because it was written first? Well the Vedas were written before the bible are they more credible? There are Sumerian creation and flood stories written before the bible, and wouldn’t you know it they bare striking resemblance to Genesis, are they more credible than the Bible?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 26, 2016 at 8:08 pm

            You have to make your own choice, I have made mine. It’s not my job to convince you. My responsibility is to preach salvation through faith in Jesus Christ.

          • byblacksheep September 26, 2016 at 10:16 pm

            Shouldn’t you have good reason for why you preach that? I also like how you’ve completely erased any responsibility to actually convert anybody. When you fail miserably it isn’t because you have given me absolutely no reason why I should believe you over any other religious peddler. Nope you just have to say some magic words over and over again and the “Holy Spirit” does all the work. Shouldn’t your goal to make the Holy Spirit do as little work as possible?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 7:17 am

            One plants the seed, another waters, God reaps the increase. It’s a team effort. I can’t be responsible for convincing you, because I am a sinful human with an incomplete understanding. All I have to do is preach Jesus Christ crucified and risen from the grave to new life. You can have this life too, by putting your faith in Jesus Christ.

            Now, if you are willing to allow the Holy Spirit to work in your heart, you can understand your sinfulness and why you need a savior. Or you can harden your heart against the Holy Spirit.

            I have given you the message I am supposed to give you. I’m not responsible for how you respond, but whatever your outcome will be, your blood is not on my hands.

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 8:08 am

            My blood is totally going to be on your hands because you’ve done a really poor job of giving me the message. Anytime I ask you why i should convert to your faith as opposed to another you ignore the question and tell me just accept Jesus, just accept God. It is really quite a beautiful tactic. Unfortunately I have critical thinking skills, and I have a hard time turning them off just to accept stories with no evidence. But what if I did turn them off and become a Christian and then tomorrow a Mormon knocks on my door (they do that you know) and tells me i shouldn’t be a Christian i should be a Mormon. Everything you have indicated to me so far is I should just accept Mormonism. And then the next day there might be a Muslim planting seeds, I’m not using any critical thinking skills so why shouldn’t I just accept it? If you want me to just accept the bible, why the bible and not the Koran . If you want me to be afraid of hell why your hell and not somebody else’s? You say Your God is the one true God, you and everybody else peddling a religion bud. So tell me why, why your religion and not another?

            Real talk: Why are you a Christian? Did you grow up in it? And if so did you ever explore other religions? Or did you convert later in life? And if you did what cinched it for you?

          • Matthew S. Lawrence September 27, 2016 at 10:37 am

            I’m a Christian because I accepted Jesus Christ as my savior.

            Religion is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is your personal relationship with God, and that is mediated by Jesus Christ.

            You don’t need a priest or a religion.

            When you decide to believe in Jesus you receive the Holy Spirit and you pass from death to life. The Holy Spirit will help you understand truth.

          • byblacksheep September 27, 2016 at 10:59 am

            No that’s HOW you became a Christian. I want to know WHY you became a Christian. And don’t say you were a sinner and needed a savior blah, blah, blah. I know what the bible teaches, I want to know why you believed it. And why, out of all the religions in the world that teach the “right” way to live, ect ect, why did you pick this one. Did you grow up with it? Did you convert? What was going on.

            Truth isn’t dependent on some invisible, intangible entity, it is just truth. If I can only understand your truth with the help of a ghost I might as well go into the desert, smoke some peyote, and wait for my ancestors to reveal the truth to me in a spirit vision. That makes just as much sense.

      • Reply essiep September 23, 2016 at 12:32 pm

        Wrong again. Your exposures are actually misunderstandings.

  • Reply byblacksheep September 23, 2016 at 1:11 pm

    believing the bible is true without evidence because the bible says it is true is circular reasoning.

    I didn’t say there was an absence of evidence, I said the evidence tells us something else happened. And that is a flaw in your paradigm

    but you’ve gotten to the point I wanted to make, just because we don’t have evidence of how DNA might add DNA, by your own reasoning doesn’t mean it can’t/didn’t happen. You have no more reason to disbelieve evolution then you have to disbelieve the Bible. But we have a whole lot more historical evidence in support of evolution than we do for the Exodus narrative.

    • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 1:31 pm

      I have exactly the same evidence that you have, the difference is interpretation. You choose to believe an ancient earth but it can’t be proven

      • Reply essiep September 23, 2016 at 2:52 pm

        It can, and has been many times in different ways.
        Your paradigm is centred on denialism.

      • Reply fnils-kmix December 30, 2017 at 9:59 am

        I want to point out that scientific reasoning does not necessarily deny or preclude the historical existence of a biblical figure such as Moses, even if there is no direct archaeological evidence.
        The biblical text tells the story of someone named Moses, who lived more than 3000 years ago and was a religious leader and a great man. This story contains legendary and supernatural elements, since it was written by Moses and his followers about three millennia ago, and reflects the way(s) of thinking and the beliefs of people at that time.
        A number of details of the story could be explained allegorically or rationally, but behind the legend there is a historical basis. Moses elaborated a new religious system and gave interpretations to older historical and religious events. These interpretations were influenced by earlier existing religions, mythologies and belief systems.
        The Earth was formed more than 4 billions years ago according to the latest scientific estimates, but that doesn’t mean that a man named Moses (who for example was subsequently mentioned by several ancient writers) did not exist.
        Science, the scientific method, and rational analysis can help explain historical events better, including events related to ancient history and religion.

        • Reply Matty Lawrence December 30, 2017 at 4:46 pm

          That’s your opinion. Thanks for your feedback.

  • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence September 23, 2016 at 8:12 pm

    All circular reasoning based on choosing to believe your conclusion.

  • Reply kertsen November 18, 2016 at 5:29 pm

    Matthew Christians are a very broad church there are many believers who accept the theory of evolution even the Pope is among them. There is a site run by scientists called Reasons to Believe which believe in the latest scientific discoveries. The group of young earth believers is much smaller. Fortunately religions are moving with the times and in this the Christian Religion is one of the leaders. Many accept same sex marriage and women priests.

  • Reply kertsen November 20, 2016 at 5:10 am

    Yes I do understand your position but it is a very harsh and unforgiving one. You need to think again and come to terms with the modern world.

    • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence November 20, 2016 at 10:58 am

      God will forgive you any time you ask. Jesus Christ will wash your sins away and give you everlasting life. God is the same yesterday, today and forever. The modern world hasn’t changed anything.

      • Reply kertsen November 20, 2016 at 2:34 pm

        The modern world has changed things enormously , that is why we know so much more about the natural world and medicine has leapt ahead. We are ethical beings with a conscience that we often ignore but the voice of conscience is always there judging us.
        I know very few can turn the other cheek but we can aspire to ‘ do as we would be done by’.

  • Reply kertsen November 21, 2016 at 10:00 am

    The conscience is what distinguishes us from the animal kingdom. A tiger or a crocodile cannot be guilty of murder but a man or woman can because they have consciences.
    On the conscience is built the law and every human tribe or nation will have laws to guide its citizens and maintain a fair and just society. The conscience by judging ourselves makes us sensitive to the feelings of other humans and animals and it is the origin of religion. It is depicted in the old testament when they ate of the tree of knowledge and the conscience was awakened. Darwin tried to explain it as the growth of mutual benefit from certain types of behaviour but more modern thinkers like the evolutionary psychologist Steven Pinker believes it was developed in the human brain as we moved from Hunter gatherers to crop growers.

    • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence November 21, 2016 at 1:53 pm

      Would you be surprised to know that the conscience is one of the two witnesses we have of the truth about God?

      The first witness is the creation itself. The second is our conscience which is the result of God writing his law (moral code) on our hearts.

      As a result of this it is accurate to say that the truth about God has been shown to everyone, and thus no one has an excuse.

      Disbelief is active, not passive. It is not the default state.

      Modern science has filled our minds with layers of obscurity such that we have to appeal to “experts” to unravel the secrets of the universe. But there really are no dark secrets.

      The dominant paradigm of modern science is based on several assumptions, all of which are in fact leaps of faith.

      Science can’t prove that the earth orbits the sun, that radioactive isotopes have always decayed at a constant rate, or the evolutionary origin of mankind.

      The reason that most people choose to believe those things is an attempt to relegate God to the state of irrelevant/optional for the purpose of carrying out sinful immoral lives other no guilt or fear of judgement.

      It doesn’t work.

      We still have guilt for our unconfessed sin no matter what modern science has to say about it.

      The only hope for forgiveness and salvation is through faith in Jesus Christ.

      • Reply kertsen November 21, 2016 at 2:38 pm

        I will be frank you are misjudging your fellow man not everyone is desperate to lead a sinful life. The apostle Paul did not do what he wanted to do and that applies to many of us today. Human goodness is a graduation of saintly behaviour down to evil depravity as the witness of the world shows us. The only real proof of science is the fact that it works and has explained much of the natural world. There is still much debate about absolutes some believing much is in the mind. We have to be pragmatists and take what is good and use it for the well-being of our fellow man. Today we are surrounded by experts both practical and theoretical ; do you repair your own car , wire your own house? We have to trust experts or drop out of civilised life. Likewise theoretical experts explain the turning of the earth and the effects of gravity or magnetism.

        • Reply Matthew S. Lawrence November 21, 2016 at 3:32 pm

          Proof of science is that it works? My naive friend, the fact that science works doesn’t prove anything other than the internal logic of a false paradigm is consistent.

          Most people take the fact that we landed a space craft on a comet as proof that science is right about heliocentricity. However, because of the way math works, specifically Newton’s law of gravity and the inverse square law, the gravitational calculations involved in the space flight are still accurate whether the earth orbits the sun or the sun orbits the earth.

          In the alternate paradigm, of the sun orbiting the earth, the mass of the sun is a fraction of what it is thought to be, but the masses of all the other planets are relatively smaller also. Mathematically the two models are the same except on completely different scales. The gravitational interaction between the planetary bodies and our satellites are no different.

          Heliocentricity is a concept we us to understand our observations but it doesn’t define the cosmos.

          Your simplistic attitude is very common. Pretty much everyone these days thinks that the iPhone is so cool that they couldn’t possibly be in danger of hell fire. It could be said that the success of technology has allowed us to abdicate the responsibility of our spiritual lives, figuring that science has eliminated spiritual problems.

          And yes I do fix my own car and house.

          Civilized life? Don’t kid yourself that it has dispelled the spiritual danger we all face.

          • kertsen November 21, 2016 at 5:15 pm

            Let me straight away confess my background is not an educated one and all I have learnt is self taught . I’m a layman in nearly all subjects and my IQ is about 105 which is slightly above average. So you see I’m rather obliged to be simplistic doing the best I can to make sense of the world. As you know intelligence gives a bell curve and 50% of us are below 100, so yes simplicity is quite common you no the parable of the talents. To me your sense of the world is a sheep and goats one , saved or unsaved, black or white , good or evil, true or false. I think you are seeking perfection and a system that puts us all in one of two pigeon- holes. ‘ It could be said the success of technology has allowed us to abdicate our responsibility of our spiritual lives or it could be said it has given us tools to take greater responsibility for what we do and how we live.

          • Matthew S. Lawrence November 21, 2016 at 5:46 pm

            I really appreciate the discussion that we are having, and thank you for your patience and time.

            I’m not here to judge you or anyone else, I don’t know what is in your heart: only God does.

            My concern is that death is not the sweet nothingness that modern science wants you to believe: the karmic return of our molecules and energy into the environment.

            Death is just a physical one of the body, and our soul has to continue for ever. If we knew Jesus Christ during our lifetime then we are purified, placed into a new body and we go on into eternity in the presence of almighty God. The sheep, as you correctly put it.

            The goats, those that rejected Christ will pass through death and awake to the horror of torment in hell.

            It’s not a pretty picture. There are times when I feel like apologizing for even writing the words. However the burden has been placed on me to want to reach out and deliver this message.

            If I know the truth and I have the ability to warn people but don’t do it: their blood will be on my hands.

            If I warn people and they reject me then I am not responsible for their outcome.

            Yes, it’s bleak, but you would be well served by reading in the Bible the last two chapters: Revelation 21 & 22. The glory that awaits us is beyond anything we can imagine 😃

          • kertsen November 22, 2016 at 2:14 pm

            Well I did read those chapters and they are not completely new to me. The book of Revelation is a minefield full of difficulties for all the churches , the trouble being everyone has their own view of its various meanings, but ‘ wipe away all tears no more death or sorrow , and no more pain ‘ is surely a desire of all good men even if sometimes they fail to make the grade. You are right we must try not to judge but to encourage those who have fallen into evil ways. I’m 75 now but I still remember my old fathers words ‘ there but for the grace of God go I ‘, he died in 1995 aged 81 of a heart attack. I don’t doubt for one second your genuine honesty and desire to do what you think is right.
            As you well know the internet is full of all sorts just as the world is , but I make an effort to talk to anyone no matter how cutting they may seem. I do my very best to avoid confrontation but I do question some ideas and beliefs , trying to remember people are more important than what they claim to believe. Although being retired and having time to blog I do still read and listen to music. I live within a stones throw of the sea and just to walk and watch the waves lifts my spirit tremendously.

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